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February 15, 2006
Chronos Users Revolt (Updated)
Updated Entry!
I have been talking to members of the ChronosTalk Google Group, as well as Senior Management at Chronos.
What wasn't clear to me originally is that this entire episode centered around the antics of one user. There are other individuals participating in various forums, including ChronosTalk, who are unhappy with the way Chronos conducts their forums but saying that they were "run out on rails" was something that Chronos objected to. Apparently one of them has been, and its unfortunate really that something escalated so far as to have Chronos think that this required such drastic action, but Chronos has a right to run their forums however they want.
The most important part of my correspondance with Chronos was this:
This isn't an outrageous request. Apple themselves will go through and purge things from Apple discussions when they don't meet the criteria that Apple designates for their discussions.
Chronos management also informs me that they have only taken action against one individual in particular who was especially unable or unwilling to abide by the rules of the Chronos forum. So while there may be other individuals that feel that this person was treated unfairly, they will no doubt be welcome to discuss or commiserate with fellow users on ChronosTalk that feel somehow slighted.
I suppose the best suggestion that can be given is to read the discussions in ChronosTalk and make your own conclusions based on that. I can say that the management at Chronos has been quite responsive anad more than willing to answer any and all questions I've given them, and this leads me to believe that they did everything they could before taking drastic actions to remove a user from their community. Since the Chronos forums are intended as a customer-outreach and troubleshooting resource for their users, I don't think they have any obligation not to censor or otherwise remove posts that don't meet their criteria. I don't think that this is a real travesty, there are plenty of discussion forums about products that are well outside the purview of the publisher or retailer.
Fact is, there are users that feel slighted in some way and have decided to take their conversations elsewhere. This happens with every publisher of software. It still remains to be seen if the ChronosTalk mailing list will end up being anything other than a water cooler to moan about Chronos, but you never know.
I have no reason to believe that people are making up claims that their posts are edited or deleted, but Chronos did say that this has never happened. They claim that they removed posts from one person, who is clearly bent out of shape about it. Chronos told me that they don't edit posts and that they haven't deleted any posts other than the ones from their problem child, however some of the users I spoke to did say that Chronos has asked them to edit their own posts. That seems a bit rash at first glance, but it is a perfectly reasonable request. They can run their forums any way they want, which is precisely why some users are more comfortable talking about their products elsewhere.
This could be taken as a cautionary tale of sorts. Everything I could find on the Chronos site from the user in question was usually remarkably helpful. This user responded to fellow users often before Chronos themselves. Granted, I know some posts have been deleted, but every post Chronos left behind that was authored by this individual really paints an interesting picture. This guy should have been on the Chronos payroll for all the assistance he was giving his fellow users. He was always at the ready with assistance for his fellow users, though often candidly. These are the passionate users that most companies desperately try to seek -- they evangelize and keep you on your toes and drive development to make your products better. I really don't understand why a user like this is such a burden on a software publisher, when the posts on the Chronos forums lead me to believe that they could benefit from a deeper QA cycle and critical feedback.
As for my opinion on some of their products, captured below:
Not that my opinion matters much, but I've always felt that their Applications were somehow out of sync with the rest of the competition. How can you possibly compare F-10 Launch Studio with something as versatile and elegant as QuickSilver? How can I in good conscience recommend you switch to StickyBrain when DEVONthink is lightyears ahead of it?
Like I said, it is my opinion. It is unbiased in that I don't care if anyone uses any of the products mentioned and I have no stake in any of them. I've used StickyBrain in the past. I've also used F-10 Launch Studio. I didn't like them. I thought there were much better options out there. Unbiased doesn't mean merely nodding and smiling.
I was completely unimpressed by the versions of StickyBrain I had used and found most reviewers to be far too forgiving of its shortcomings. Having said that, I have not used StickyBrain 4, and it appears to be a completely different application from the one I last used. Though F-10 Launch Studio seems remarkably underwhelming when compared to even LaunchBar, which is trailing behind the free QuickSilver in my usage.
Since I feel that the version of StickyBrain I used wasn't good, I offered to give SitckyBrain 4 a try and write an actual review of it, rather than my opinion. Chronos's management mentioned that they didn't think I could write a positive review because of my strong opinion of their older release.
I don't know if thats true. If I didn't like their software in the past, they're assuming I wouldn't like it today. Why not? Is it not better? They list several improvements on their website, and it does seem to be a very different application from the I last used. Just because I thought the older one wasn't any good doesn't mean that I'd think the new one came up short too. I can see why they'd be concerned that my review wouldn't be positive. I think I've demonstrated that I have a strong opinion. But reviews shouldn't be positive unless the product warrants it, right?
I debated not even publishing an update to this story, and just yanking it. But I got the distinct impression that the people at Chronos didn't want to hear any criticism, even in a private email. They didn't seem to believe that I could evaluate something on its merits because of my strong opinions of the older versions of their application. I would hope that improvements were made to their applications to make them better, in order to compel users to upgrade, and to get new users.
At some point in the near future I'll be kicking the tires on StickyBrain. There is a lot of competition in the small personal information manager space these days, and a lot of people do seem to love StickyBrain, so they're doing something right. I think I've made it pretty clear that I don't coddle software developers. I would think that those are precisely the kind of reviews someone would want to read. I'm not compelled to buy StickyBrain by reading a superficial review of the Chronos marketing materials. If people want a review that consists of regurgitating these marketing materials of the publisher, you can certainly find them, but I don't think that helps anyone except the publisher. Our audience is largely mobile Mac users that have work to do. Software reviews should help people make a decision.
StickyBrain isn't an expensive application, but there are free methods of managing information as well and I think a critical look at applications like it benefit the users as well as the publisher. Giving a critical look doesn't mean negative. It means critical. I don't understand why my opinion of StickyBrain in the past taints my opinion on the product now, but I can't help but be very curious why they think it would. Software should evolve and get better over time. It seems like a logical progression to me. I'm perfectly willing to accept the possibility that StickyBrain 4 is amazing. Anything is possible. As an example I thought Apple Mail was completely inept until Tiger. I still think that their implementation of IMAP sucks because it can't handle something as fundemental as folder subscriptions. Ever try reading email off an Exchange Server with a bunch of Public Folders? What a travesty that is!
It is entirely possible that ChronosTalk will wither and die, and very likely that people will happily continue to post their bug reports on the official Chronos Forums, and all of this will soon be forgotten. But I think it is important to realize that sometimes you will get a passionate user that will try to keep you honest, and there may be a lesson there for publishers to learn from.
Posted by emory at February 15, 2006 8:07 AM
Category: Opinion
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Comments
Oh boy oh boy. There are a couple points I would like to make on this article, mostly about Chronos as a company and their attitude towards users.
I manage a small independent apple dealer in the northeast, and it is my responsibility to make sure we sell quality products. We have traditionally sold the Chronos products as they are *usually* adequate for new or novice users.
The problem I found was this. They don't offer ANY free tech support. You cannot even EMAIL THEM for free. $10 per email support request. There is absolutely no tech support phone number, so calling them is out of the question.
What sort of attitude is this? I understand tech support does cost money, but to offer ZERO free tech support even for out of the box installation issues is assinine!
I had a pre-sales question about the capabilities of their product, and as far as I could tell there were two options. Download the demo product and spend an hour futzing with it to try to figure it out, or pay $10 to ask the question. I did download the product, and with almost TWO hours into it, I discovered their setup was incredibly painful and our average home or small office user would not be able to cope with it with NO tech support.
For this reason, our company does not and will sell Chronos products. We will not recommend them, nor will we even special order them for customers.
Posted by: pwrbkdude at February 15, 2006 9:21 AM
the 'perp' in question, dancingbrook, is not the world's favorite poster either ... you might wish to take a look at the google:maintosh_pims list to judge for yourself.
imho, bottom line is that Chronos' newest Tiger-firendly/pure-Cocoa products have bugs. gee, what a surprise.
as a long-time user myself, i'm not happy. BUT ... they've been responsive, polite and professional ... and have gone way out of their way to clearly state/post their policies on their forum site.
as for dancingbrook's personal vendetta agains Chronos ... he got bounced for repeatedly violating their policies, which he agreed to.
doesn't matter if he USED TO BE the most helpful person on the planet, when he starts doing damage ... get rid of him. i know as a Chronos forum user that the forums are a LOT more usable without his incessant & irrelevant bitching & complaining.
as for lack of free support ... that's what the forums are for. Chronos have clearly stated their support policies ... and, as an end user, knowing their resources, i'd rather they earn a liing and stay in business. i fyou don't like their policies, do what you've done, and don't use their products.
as for me, i'll contribute to their success -- and mine -- as i can. in the end, their produuct is STILL BY FAR closest to the "right solution" i'm looking for.
Posted by: passerby at February 15, 2006 3:09 PM
pwrbkdude, find me offline and I may be able to send customers your way. Emory has the address.
Emory,
You did a pretty good job. You got most of the details right; close enough. You'll have noticed Chronos is lightly confronting a little OT on their forums now, though of course praise is still quite acceptable even though it too is "against the rules". In other words, their forums are primarily self-serving, and secondarily self-serviing serving, and all just so they have a place to say they offer support (even if you might have to wait several days and still not get a response; that's not support). And they really shouldn't call them "discussions".
Good of you to notice how it wasn't hard to beat them to answering questions; that was deliberate (and it took little effort) to point out how they were neglecting their users. Apparently it worked as now they are re-spinning the neglect by saying they have been almost exclusively responding to users problems (which is also likely spin), but of course to the dismay of those waiting for the software to be finished. Everything is an excuse for the other. Being on their payroll indeed; but they haven't even refund my money as they promised.
I do think you fell short of displaying their intent to focus on a single bad guy (an "evil doer", like politicians do ;-), to serve as a scapegoat, as an example of "what could happen to you" if you get out of line. But as you have seen, there are many others who are willing to speak up and be censored (and of course countless others who don't). And as politicians should do, you have also seen that they should spend at least 100x as much energy understanding why there is a problem and preventing it, as they do attacking those who point it out.
IMHO, reviews shouldn't "be" positive or negative; editorials are for telling us what to think. Reviews should "be" subjectively and objectively descriptive, and you should always point to other alternative reviews (and certainly not to the regurgitated PR that you mentioned). Or better, point to the uncensored user discussions such as ChronosTalk (as you have) and the Macintosh PIMs (both user established Google Groups), and the reader can draw their own conclusions. Of course all reviewers should have uncensored access to users so they can gather the experience of others as well as their own. (Do you suppose they can see ChronosTalk as possibly being good for them? I encourage them to put a link to it on their forums. '-)
I find it quite interesting that they would suggest what you should publish, but censor what their users can publish in their own forums. You will notice that the vast majority of threads in their forums (and apparently their time for the last couple of months) has focused on bugs and major deficits in the software. Look at the forums of other apps (good ones) and you will see mostly users sharing ideas on how to better use a product, not mostly asking how to get it running or keep it running. They released betaware as finished product and now everyone involved is paying the price for that decision, except you. You get fodder. ;-)
Posted by: db at February 15, 2006 3:42 PM
BTW: ChronosTalk isn't intended to be a place to report bugs; it is a place to discuss anything Chronos, especially anything Chronos won't allow on their website.
You can't even make reference to another product there, like "I wish you guys would just make it work like Daylite does."
Posted by: db at February 15, 2006 5:56 PM
Chronos has discussion forums for free tech support.
Posted by: Neil at February 15, 2006 7:07 PM
so is 'db' here 'dancingbrook' too?
Posted by: nicka at February 16, 2006 12:08 AM

